Edwin, if Issac had been a sacrifice before Abraham's eyes who would have suffered the most?... suffering has various levels and physical pain is only one of them. If the Father did leave at Jesus final parting then he did so to suffer another level of agony. It was not a cop-out

We could also consider what is meant by heaven and hell, is hell the same as Dantes inferno painting.. or not?

most believe all the scriptures, How many think Jesus is not going to return or has already returned I haven't a clue.

The Holy Spirit that dwells within me says amen to many things my brothers and sisters preach for all those with an indwelling of the Holy Spirit have a relationship with each other and identify each other by their testimony in Christ. Thats just how it is and how we are related to each other through Christ!.

I'd be really interested in how many say amen to the thoughts that Christ's return has come and gone and we are all waiting in vain

DM you tell us to rip the page from the bible and that seems to be a habit ripping out and discarding verses. I'll take it as a whole thankyou even the parts you discard and yes i do try to reason on your wavelength and get the point you are making but If Jesus 2nd coming came and every eye didn't see and the scriptureS yet to be fulfilled with regard to the Jews didn't happen then what did?

Obviously no rapture which I have no view for or against its not anything I personally can choose or not choose it will happen or not happen ...... or in your case (past tense) has or has not happened

DM on a side issue I have had my disagreements with Mike many times but the quality nugget that always lingers from Mike is that admits he may not be right, I've said on many occasions I stand on the faith and understanding I have today but that may change tomorrow by new revelation and has done throughout my whole life so I have many regrets at teaching wrong thoughts and I know that some things I'm doubly sure of today will be wrong tomorrow when that new revelation hits home.

How about you DM are you ever not right?

As you say my faith and trust in Jesus may be too simplistic, although you may imagine i could be offended by that comment I actually see it as a complement.  Principles are wonderful in their simplicity because we have a God thing inside of us (made in Gods image) that "gets" principles.

Jesus believed Moses is simple yes

and the part that you accidentally missed out when quoting me explains why its important

Ivor also wrote

Anyone convicted of lying as no credence in any other testimony they speak of therefore the connotations that Moses is a liar reaches through time to Jesus in John 5 46 because Jesus "did" trust Moses's words as evidence for himself and that leads all the way up to our time and our faith in Jesus speaking truth too!

Faith in scripture is not such blind faith as some people imagine it to be. My Jesus is love and love never fails therefore because Jesus always speaks truth, I therefore always believe it. This is relational between Jesus and me but may not be rational to the lastest thinking of others

As with many English words "saved" is not the best word.. Salvation is in the Lord, with him who will never leave us holding our right hand and saying "do not be afraid, I myself will help you!" For all the talk we hear of pressing on to maturity we are but children in God's eyes. As Father he adopted us and rightly demands obedience but knows we will fall short. He will do what is required to change us but falling short is not the same as rebelling.

We can run the race for the prize that is set before us (a seat at the table, a seat in the house, a seat in the courtyard and a place in the land) but we cannot run the race for salvation because that is not within our grasp for the very reason that the enemy would tear it from us. Thankfully our salvation bought through the precious blood of our Lord is in His hand alone. He gives it to us as a gift but he holds it in his keeping until such time as the enemy has been overcome and we can mature to full stature to resist him.

I agree, and their reward is huge that they are named in scripture as an example to us

I like that!